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WesleyWildcat84

Sports Animal
Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 897

	11/10/09 at 12:56 PM	Reply with quote	#16

Break it down, respond accordingly... here are the sections: A. Coaches are always evaluating their team, and they're not thinking about the Preseason when they make in-season changes (like keeping Brady in place of Bledsoe for one). B. Offseason only evaluation is for teams that have it figured out, not teams that are in a complete overhaul. C. If Preseason matters, Rod Marinelli is a Hall of Famer 4-0 Preseason Yay! Detroit is a perfect example how it doesn't matter and isn't indicative of how good your team is really. D. Freeman did better than Sanchez statistically (other than completion percentage) and Sanchez's hype is team driven. Everyone said Freeman needed time, and maybe this is good. E. Gruden is a sub .500 coach, who based on his track record, was due for a downfall, or we'd have the same team on a nosedive last year. I'll take a 4 win Morris vs. a 6 win Gruden. F. We're the sixth worst at the moment, all things accounted for, and why (if you see recent history) can't we have a down year and get way better next year? G. The only statistical category that matters in the end is the W. If you want the details, go back to the post, you can figure it out.
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WesleyWildcat84

Sports Animal
Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 897

	11/10/09 at 01:16 PM	Reply with quote	#17

The Bucs are a full blown Class 3 that may look like a Class 4 to you. Everyone said Freeman was a project. If the Bucs win all the rest of their games, damned if they do, damned if they don't, get "Why didn't we start this kid sooner?" If the Bucs had lost all of their games so far, "Why didn't we wait to start this kid?" Go with what almost everyone said, which was "wait," and look forward to next year. McCown vs. Leftwich was because we thought they were that much better. They were not apparently. At kicker, that's not messing around, Bryant was injured, Nugent sucked, Andrus apparently wasn't much better, and Barth can hit the endzone for touchbacks and apparently might know what he's doing. I'm sure we were messing around back when Gramatica went off the deep end too. It happens. On the Offensive Coordinator, better to fire him before he can do any real damage and we fire him at the end of the year. On Brooks, how'd we mess around with him? We kicked him to the curb, and NO ONE picked him up. If Freeman wins the rest of his games, that says the coaching staff will be criticized for doing what everyone expected them to do with unexpected results, and the fair weathers with say, "Why did we wait?" I'm sure Belichick's an idiot for keeping that Hall of Fame sixth rounder that's still starting for him on the bench for over a year. If you want to bring out age on Raheem Morris, let's bring up Josh McDaniels... he's about the same age... whoops, there goes that argument. As for my first ever job, I wasn't hurried and ended up sticking around for awhile. Gee... I sound like Josh Freeman. I learned from a spot where I couldn't mess things up too much until I had learned. We NEEDED new leadership in Tampa, we got it. As for Dungy, he replaced Sam Wyche, who prior to Tampa had a good record. Dungy gave this team winning and credibility, and the debates over Gruden's only great year (other than maybe 11-5, because 10 wins is most people's standard for playoffs and big time teams) vs. Dungy getting us within a touchdown of the then "Greatest Show on Turf" and so on so forth keeps raging on. Morris is the guy to bring this team back to respectability. Either he'll be Joe Maddon and lead this team to the promised land, or one of the guys who tried and failed along the way. Eventually, if he succeeds, his bar will be set on expectations, and he'll be a Dungy who led the way, but eventually became a victim of his success. Who is Mike Smith? Jim Harbaugh? Tony Sparano? Second year head coaches of Atlanta, Baltimore, and Miami. Man, you are dying to hire Eric Mangini from Cleveland... he's been a playoff head coach... in New York! Morris is the guy and if he isn't he'll be the victim of his own words, "I'll tolerate you until I can replace you," and unless you're begging for another season like this, a team on reset, that's not coming too soon. Who do you want? I'll give you reasons why not to want who you want.
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theodore337
Outfield
Registered: 11/02/09
Posts: 96

	11/10/09 at 11:25 PM	Reply with quote	#18

If Raheem went 6-0, I think this message boards would be different. I would have thought Rod Marinelli would have been rehired as a head coach for the bucs, I thought he would have made a better fit than Raheem. Josh McDaniels went 6-0 so he is a great coach. His record will dictate the rest of his greatness. As far as Josh McDaniels being a young coach he did not come in as the players best friend. Like Raheem is doing. How do you think Raheem would have handled Brandon Marshall? Josh McDaniels sat his sorry ass down for 9 days for being a pain in the ass. The impression in Dever is that people respect McDaniels and he has the support of the community. Of course winning has almost everything to do with that. But this is the nature of the business which they are in. Win or go home. And when fans are spending big dollars on tickets and $10 warm beers we do not want to go to a game and see a bunch of losers. Players Play - Coaches Coach and Losers get kicked off the team (just ask the last couple of kickers)
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WesleyWildcat84

Sports Animal
Registered: 02/27/09
Posts: 897

	11/11/09 at 02:57 PM	Reply with quote	#19

Oh yeah. Even if the Bucs were 3-4 or something the boards would be different. As for Rod Marinelli, you really can't be serious. The guy went back to what he does best, and that's D-Line in Chicago with Lovie Smith. Rod is a good guy and good assistant, but he was 10-38 overall in Detroit and he was the infamous 0-16 last year. It's not entirely his fault that Detroit had no talent, but if Detroit wasn't that awful, he may not have gotten that job because some better coach might have signed up. On Josh McDaniels being now 6-2, to quote Bill Parcells, who I'm not sure many will argue with on his great axioms, "You are what your record says you are." I get flack about Gruden vs. Dungy and Gruden's years after the Super Bowl year (Gruden's great, blame the owners). We wouldn't even hear about Gruden if Morris was burning it up or atleast we were over .500 for the season. McDaniels is new, but hey Mike Shanahan was 24-24 over the last three years and he was 8-8 and lost his last four last year WITH the vaunted Jay Cutler who isn't really tearing it up in Chicago. Denver might be better WITHOUT him. So McDaniels just needs a good year, and if he makes it to the playoffs, that'll be amazing and an upgrade over gasp Mike Shanahan? That guy? Don't get me wrong Shanahan is a good coach, but stop trying to replace our new coach so quickly. On the two ways of coaching, McDaniels came in and showed them whose boss, but if you read recent articles mentioning a dress code and taking away the players music, don't call that small fries, because that stuff matters to the players I'm sure. On Brandon Marshall, I'm not sure if Marshall would have come off the tracks and we don't have him anyways. Why we don't have Jay Cutler might be because we didn't want a rebel rouser to find out. What McDaniels did was give the guy a break to cool off during a time when Marshall's services weren't needed. If Marshall pulls that crap this week, you'll hear about it, but I don't know that they suspended him. Further, if McDaniels loses his next two games, he could be a victim of his own success, or, and this is smart, he'll get a pass, if he can pull out of a free fall. Rah's line is that "I'll tolerate you until I can replace you." I also think that people need to stop whining about the revolving door of this year. As the season heads towards the end and when the music stops, the players better know that if they don't have a chair, then they're going to be done or fighting not to be done. Unlike Denver, who had some young pieces to work with already. Good post man.
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Pharside11

Pitcher
Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 391

	11/15/09 at 12:47 PM	Reply with quote	#20

I think most our missing the point on Freeman, yea there are going to be the people that come out and say that Freeman is this great QB after one game... Give him some freaking time! When he has a bad game you naysayers are going to do the same thing and say he is a bust, hypocrites....The reason why I am stoked about Freeman is the 70 yard drive in the 4th, I don't care if the Buc's would have lost that game I would still be saying that I am impressed with Freeman after that drive. He made some mistakes in that game and missed some throws and shook it off and led the team down the field and scored when it counted and then converted a big 2pt conversion.. If you watched that game he looked like a rookie at times but definatly looked like a guy who can become a great NFL QB also, he has all the tools. Bottom line we will not know for another 2 years if Freeman was a good pick or not...
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Pharside11

Pitcher
Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 391

	11/15/09 at 12:51 PM	Reply with quote	#21

Quote: Hey, I'm not worried about people giving fair criticism, but the doomsday sayers who are calling for Gruden to come back need to shut the f* up and let this team develop. AMEN!!!**
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JustaBuc
Pitcher
Registered: 03/05/09
Posts: 428

11/16/09 at 10:16 AM

Reply with quote

#22

Quote:

Quote: Hey, I'm not worried about people giving fair criticism, but the doomsday sayers who are calling for Gruden to come back need to shut the f* up and let this team develop. AMEN!!!**

Funny, the only time I have heard that statement is by the Gruden haters. Those of us who did not hate Gruden have only pointed out that the team took a step backward at the HC position, that is a fact. Raheem may very well become a good HC over time, but those of us that pay to attend games would prefer that their HC get his training elsewhere, then come here and do something like...win a Super Bowl, something no other HC here could or could have done.

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Pharside11

Pitcher
Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 391

	11/19/09 at 06:19 PM	Reply with quote	#23

Quote: Funny, the only time I have heard that statement is by the Gruden haters. Those of us who did not hate Gruden have only pointed out that the team took a step backward at the HC position, that is a fact. Raheem may very well become a good HC over time, but those of us that pay to attend games would prefer that their HC get his training elsewhere, then come here and do something like...win a Super Bowl, something no other HC here could or could have done. Gruden had plenty of chances, this team was going nowhere with him and he should have been fired long before he did... I find it funny that people actually want him back. I guess people are happy with average to below average teams every year.... I think Raheem just needs some time, we are rebuilding, our Defense would still be sorry as hell if Gruden was still the HC... And if Raheem dosn't get it done within the next two years, see ya later, next. But give him a chance...
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